Re: [libreoffice-design] Bundled english fonts

On 10/10/2016 08:32 PM, Yousuf Philips wrote:
> On 10/11/2016 12:58 AM, Francisco Adrián Sánchez wrote:
> > Hi Yussuf, all,
>
> Hi Francisco,
>
> > I'd like to help with this. I have already some opinions about it. I
> > think that there are some of the fonts that are already bundled with
> > LibreOffice that could be removed.
>
> Totally agree we need to begin by removing fonts.
>
> > I would for the approach of "2 serif fonts, 2 sans serif font, 1 or none
> > mono". Adding more and not using them in templates we provide is just
> > adding more bricks to the big wall of typefaces.
>
> Keeping a minimal selection of useful/needed fonts is definitely 
> important, but i wouldnt put such restrictions as only 2 of each time. 
> LibreOffice not only promotes free document formats, but also the 
> spread of free fonts.
I think we need 1 mono font.  There are a lot of uses for a mono font 
["normal", bold, italic, bold italic].  I have several, including a Unicode
and a "typewriter" version.  Liberation font set has a full set of Mono 
fonts/styles, or at least with my font selection.

For some people, for Windows OS, many packages/apps install fonts that 
are bundled with the installer.  I know that there are a lot of fonts 
installed with the OS install.  For Linux users, I think that the 
"ttf-mscorefonts-installer" should be bundled with LO.  That way at 
least the Linux version will have access to the same fonts as the 
Windows version.

Am I correct that some of the LO documents used Vegur fonts? Whatever 
fonts are used in the LO documentations should be included in the 
installer bundle.

Currently, I have 189 font files installed on my default laptop.  I have 
had over 400 font files installed in my Ubuntu install, which I reduced 
to the current level only a few months ago.  I have over 200,000 font 
files in my collection of fonts, including an early 2000 version of the 
Adobe font set.  Except the Adobe set, all of the fonts are [or were] 
free fonts.

To be honest, to help users, maybe LO could suggest different fonts in 
the online documentation or even have a link to a .zip file with the 
suggested fonts/files listed in the documentation for installing LO.  
Having a listing of the popular free fonts and where you could find 
them, may be a good idea.  Also for new Linux users, give the 
"ttf-mscorefonts-installer" package name.  It was several years using 
Ubuntu before I heard about the "ms core fonts" package.

So, in my opinion, we should have a list of popular free fonts in the 
online install tutorials or even a new page created specifically for the 
font list[s]. Maybe people could create list of "paid" fonts with a list 
of the best free fonts that can be used instead of the paid versions. 
There are lists online in various places that discuss the fonts that are 
installed with different versions of Windows, Mac, and Linux, and then 
list the free replacements.  If we could have a good list of free fonts 
and/or free replacement fonts that the LO users think would be a good 
for users to download and try. Just within this thread there is a lot of 
suggestions for what fonts are better than others.

Discussions like this email thread are a good start.  Maybe we could 
start a thread for a list of the better free fonts and what they can be 
used as replacements for the "popular" paid fonts.  Actually, a couple 
of font names, listed in this thread, are new to me.  Since I have been 
using Windows since Win95 [or earlier].  Linux, on and off, since late 
90's and Ubuntu as my default OS since version 9.xx.

What do "you" think about these ideas?

> > I really like Open Sans, but you already bundle Source Sans Pro and in
> > more weights: Open Sans has a light, bold and extrabold versions and
> > they were omitted. Also, there are at least 2 Impress templates based on
> > Source Sans Pro. Thus, the 2 sans would be Liberation Sans & Source Sans
> > Pro.
>
> My suggestion, which is also the suggestion of Tomaz and Adolfo, is to 
> replace Open Sans with Noto as it looks nearly identical and has large 
> language support.
>
> > I will explain why not Carlito: I'm against Carlito in its current
> > state: there are some bugs regarding its transformation from Lato, which
> > result in weird rendering. *And it's not because of the hinting* but
> > because of the squeezing of Lato to match Calibri. Please, see these 2
> > screenshots:
> > http://s2.subirimagenes.com/imagen/9647191carloto-vs-lato-2.png
> > http://s2.subirimagenes.com/imagen/9647190carloto-vs-lato-3.png
> > It's the only problem I have found by
> >
> > Also, Caladea doesn't show this errors but it *lacks of greek and
> > cyrilic support* (at least the versions bundled with LibreOffice). I
> > emphasize this because the opposite is stated in the Docs sheet)
>
> Just like Italo said, Carlito and Caladea are Microsoft compatibility 
> fonts, which make them mandatory to keep document fidelity when 
> opening on systems which dont have Microsoft proprietary formats. This 
> is the same for the Liberation font family that we ship.
>
> I'd recommend contacting google or the company who created the font to 
> ask them to fix the issue, as unfortunately it isnt something we can 
> do, unless one of the volunteer typrographers wants to take it on and 
> we ship a modified version of Carlito.
>
> > Furthermore, I don't see the point of bundling Gentium Basic _and_
> > Gentium Book Basic. Besides, *it doesn't count with Greek nor Cyrillic
> > support*... or at least, the versions bundled with LibO up to 5.3 alpha.
> > Again, the opposite is stated in the Docs sheet.
>
> I know Gentium Basic is available in Google Docs's font list combobox, 
> so it must be a popular enough font that it would be listed their. 
> Gentium Book Basic is just a slightly bolder version of Gentium Basic, 
> so i would be in favour of removing it. If you look in the cell note 
> on the sheet for their language support it says "website claims it has 
> cyrillic and greek, but didnt see it in the font". :D But i decided to 
> check their website now and there is a newer version of the font there 
> but it doesnt have any additional glyphs.
>
> > Then, between PT Serif and Linux Libertine, the last has a much more
> > wider character support. So, in my opinion Liberation Serif and Linux
> > Libertine should be enough for serif typefaces.
>
> As Linux Libertine and its other related fonts take up nearly 50% of 
> the space used by all the fonts, it definitely needs to go. PT Serif 
> should likely be removed as it has very little language support and 
> was likely added as a Serif for Open Sans.
>
> > These are my 2 ¢
>
> Thanks for your input. So i've opened a bug report with my thoughts on 
> how i'd like to move forward with font selection, so you are welcome 
> to give it a read and add your 2 cents there as well. :D
>
> https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=103080
>
> > Best Regards,
> >
> > Francisco
>
> So i've
>
> Regards,
> Yousuf


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