[libreoffice-users] Re: RTF support

I hope Miklos Vajna and all the specification implementors (including 
all developers) reads this post :-)
> MS devs can then tweak just 1 or 2 tiny things quite quickly and leave 
> it to other people to guess at what's changed.
This is not the issue.
> Our devs pour a ton of work into finding out what is really being used 
> perhaps  by reverse engineering (?) and then developing an answer.
If this is really true, then this is where the problem is and where the 
developers have failed the Users regarding the RTF and any other 
specification.
Not just Libre Office, but msWord, WordPerftect, and all others 
specification driven application developers.

I continue to get replies claiming that RTF is bad bad bad bad bad and 
will never be acceptable because all the problems people currently have 
with RTF.

If an application claims to support a file format, then the #1 priority 
is and should be to correctly implement the file format specification 
(whether it be HTML, Java, RTF, docX, or any other truly implementable 
standard).
If the RTF developers would do this, then virtually all the complaints 
about RTF would (go away/disappear).
And this is true for any/all format specification.

After that, then and only then add various implementations(tweaks, etc.) 
if you so choose.

I am so glad that Miklos Vajna has decided to "fix" the Libre Office 
implementation of RTF.
Thanks, Tracey

Tom Davies [via Document Foundation Mail Archive] wrote:
> Hi :)
> Yes, Rtf is an excellent format.  It would be more useful tho if MS 
> Office
> followed their own specs but then we wouldn't be having this 
> discussion.  At the
> rate things are going the only organisation that doesn't follow MS 
> specs for rtf
> and docX will be MS themselves.
>
> Our devs pour a ton of work into finding out what is really being used 
> perhaps
> by reverse engineering (?) and then developing an answer.  MS devs can 
> then
> tweak just 1 or 2 tiny things quite quickly and leave it to other 
> people to
> guess at what's changed.  It's not really a "dirty trick" it's a 
> legitimate
> business strategy.  
>
>
> Proprietary formats are about being secretive, hiding behind intellectual
> copyright, hiding corporate secrets to help keep the competitive 
> advantage.  
>
>
> Open Document Formats are about being honest and open about what the 
> formats are
> so that everyone can incorporate them easily and be certain that 
> everyone else
> can easily follow the standard.  
>
>
> MS has chosen to ignore the new Open Document Formats (version 1.2) 
> and use the
> old formats (versions 1.0 or 1.1).  So they appear to be following ODF 
> and can
> legitimately publicly state that.  But of course they have carefully 
> made sure
> that  newer odfs still get a little messed up in MSO.  Everyone else 
> apps can
> read them perfectly.  Again, it's not a "dirty trick" but does make a 
> lot of
> sense as a legitimate business strategy.  
>
>
> Regards from
> Tom :)
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: planas <[hidden email] 
> </user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=3128731&i=0>>
> To: [hidden email] </user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=3128731&i=1>
> Sent: Thu, 30 June, 2011 15:22:32
> Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: RTF support
>
> Hi
>
> On Wed, 2011-06-29 at 06:33 -0700, tracey002 wrote:
>
> > Johnny Rosenberg wrote:
> > > Since then I always make sure no RTF files comes near me ever.
> >
> > I have all due respect for your opinion and choice and I am glad you 
> have
> > the option to do that.
> >
> > I had never thought of saving all documents in RTF (maybe not a bad 
> idea),
> > but I do find RTF very useful for the purpose for which it was 
> designed:
> > portability.
> > I have used RTF to send Documents and Data/Reports to recipients with
> > diverse Office-Applications that did NOT have a choice with the
> > Office-Application they were using (so I have successfully used RTF for
> > portability).
> >
> >
> > Sean Burke in RTF Pocket Guide wrote:
> > > For no really good reason, support for these RTF character sets is
> > > perfiect in some word processors, almost perfect in others..., and 
> shoddy
> > > in others...
> >
> > The capability of applications that state or imply RTF functionality 
> is not
> > a reflection of RTF, but on the competence (hence professionalism) 
> of the
> > developers that implement the Open/Import and Save-As/Export routines.
> >
> > This is true of *all* software: that includes the Microsoft Word 
> Veiwer 2003
> > that has problems correctly displaying the Word2002RTFSpec.doc.
> >
> > Just FYI, Tracey
> > I normally do NOT use a screw driver as a substitute for a hammer, 
> but I
> > have used a heavy duty screw driver to pound the lid back on a paint 
> can.
> > I am not upset that screwdrivers are not hammers.
> >
> >
> > --
> > View this message in context:
> > http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/RTF-support-tp3114703p3121621.html
> > Sent from the Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
> One problem with RTF is MS has different versions of the specification,
> generally released when a new version of MSO comes out. If your software
> does not read the newer versions, which I believe is the default for the
> latest MSO version you may get garbled importing on occasion.
>
> -- 
> Jay Lozier
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