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Hi Vince

Today I managed to generate thousands of zero byte files in the .config/libreoffice/4/user/backup 

They started to appear whilst I was developing a new query in the "Edit SQL" Dialog. SQL not being 
one of my core skills I do end up making mistakes!

These mistakes resulted in the "The data content could not be loaded" message box or variations 
there of because of syntax errors errors in the SQL that could only be picked up at run time.

As the mistakes built up, as I thrashed around with SQL, the editing of the query becomes very 
slow. I guess this is an indication of the problem that causes the zero byte backup files.

So nothing to do with config settings.


On Monday 10 Feb 2014 14:08:44 Vince Radice wrote:

    Hi,            I check this morning and there were over 600 empty files.            I have 
created a new configuration directory.  I cannot create    the situation with the empty files.  All 
I can do is leave my    database application up and see if any files are created.  I will    check 
occasionally and report back as to whether the problem is    fixed.  If it is not fixed, then I 
will pursue changing the engine    from hsql to something else.        Vince Radice             
On 02/03/2014 08:09 AM, Alex McMurchy      wrote:        
Have you solved this problem?      
If not - have you tried starting a completely        new configuration directory?      
Again if not this is what I would do -      
close down all Libreoffice applications      
Start a konsole session.      
Save the existing Libreoffice configuration        settings      
     *  cd .config        
     *  mv libreoffice libreoffice$(date          +"%Y%m%d%H%M%S")            
start the Libreoffice document that's been        causing the problem and see what happens!!      
If it starts to look like this has fixed the        problem you will have to reconfigure 
Libreoffice. Some of the        files can be used as is from the saved configuration.      
On Saturday 25 Jan 2014 15:00:47 Vince Radice        wrote:            
 Hi,                    From my first post -         I am running Fedora FC19-64 bit. Libreoffice 
Build ID:         My Desktop is KDE  4.11.4                The problem is that if I 
don't keep deleting these empty files,        they will build up.  I first noticed this when 
looking through        the log for my backup program.  There were over 250,000 files.         I 
assume that the overhead involved in a loist this size would        be enourmous.  I have also had 
problems where the hdd activity        was so great that I could not get much response and started  
      closing thing to try to figure out what the problem was.  Since        I have been keeping 
the empty files deleted, I have not had the        problem.                This goes back to my 
question - is anyone else seeing the same        situation?                Also, how do I fix the 
problem of empty files?                Thanks,        Vince Radice                            
On 01/17/2014 03:28 AM, Alex McMurchy wrote:            
In respect of the empty files -       
     *  Which version of          LibreOffice are you using?         
     *  Which distro are you using?         
     *  Which desktop?         
     *  Is it causing you any          hardship?             
On Thursday 16 Jan 2014 10:10:31 Vince Radice        wrote:       
It is Thursday morning. I looked and        there were 10 empty files in the       
backup directory from 10:49 pm to 10:50        pm. When I tried to bring the       
database down this morning, it would not        come down - Starter was not       
responding. I waited several times to        see if it would clear up and       
end. Nothing. I finally terminated the        application. Started Calc to       
cause the recovery procedure to work.        Recovery was successful and no       
data was lost.       
I still cannot figure out what is        causing the problem. I had thought       
that leaving it up overnight would        create the files.       
Any suggestions as to what to do next?        Any options that might need to       
be changed.       
Here is a link to a screen print of my        LO Load/Save options.     [1]            
As for the change to a different        backend, I am open to suggestions. The       
size of my database now is about 900k. I        make a few additions each       
week. So a small and fast is        appropriate. I am open to suggestions.       
On 01/16/2014 06:17 AM, Tom Davies        wrote:       
Hi :)       
This mailing list might be able to        help you migrate your existing       
tables to an external back-end.        There was a looong thread about this       
a few years ago when Ian (err can't        remember his surname [hangs head       
in shame]). It is roughly what i        hope to do = start with the internal       
back-end and then migrate it.       
To be fair it's not Hsql that is        the problem. It's the ancient       
version that got twisted and        squeezed into being the internal back-end       
in Base and then didn't get enough        further developments. As an       
external back-end, if you grab any        of their newer versions straight       
from their website, then it        apparently works like a dream (errr as in       
super fast and smooth, not as in        imaginary). On the other hand it       
might be good to choose a different        back-end and there are plenty to       
choose from.       
When choosing a back-end it might        be worth considering what sort of       
size are you talking about.        MySql/MariaDb, Postgresql and other big       
names are meant for huge amounts of        data. I mean really vast and       
quite complex. For an address book        for a small-medium sized business       
it's over kill and you might find        them comparatively sluggish when       
handling that little data. What i        need is something small and fast       
but that often points to java-based        ones such as Hsql and java makes       
me shudder.       
Regards from       
Tom :)       
On 16 January 2014 01:19, Vince        Radice <>[2]        wrote:       
Unfortunately, I don't know        what causes the problem and, thus, I can't       
recreate it.       
I am trying something now. I        brought it up, updated a record but did not       
save it (I have a saved copy        someplace else). I intend to let it be up       
overnight and check in the        morning for the files. I had already cleared out       
all of the empty ones. I noted        the time I brought is up and made the       
I want to see if it reoccurs.        if so, then when. I also intend to save it       
and close it in the morning. If        the files are there, see if the creation       
stops. Hopefully, this will        lead to why it is happening.       
On another tangent, I had lost        data and had to recreate the db. During that       
process, I read a few things        indicating that using HSQL could lead to losing       
data. The recommendation was to        use an external db. I spent several weeks       
last year trying to get Mysql        to work. I followed the conversion guidelines       
that I had found but was unable        to get it to work. I created the Mysql       
database and was able to create        and load the tables (I think) but I could       
never get Base to recognize and        use it. All of my queries and reports are       
in Base. I may have to try        again if I can find the time. This time I will       
record what I install and what        I do.       
Vince Radice       
On 01/15/2014 11:46 AM, Alex        Kempshall wrote:       
Having said all that. It        would appear that I've never had auto backup       
switched on.       
Having switched it on I now        see backups and autobackups for writer and       
calc documents. Nothing at        all for base documents.       
On Wednesday 15 Jan 2014        14:35:33 Alex McMurchy wrote:       
I used to have that        problem. It seems to have stopped around about 16th       
July 2013. Not sure        why!       
Either -       
I upgraded LibreOffice        which stopped the feature       
or I did something else        which I can't remember!       
I'm currently on       
On Wednesday 15 Jan        2014 07:38:25 Tom Davies wrote:       
Hi :)       
Errr, is it        possible to switch the auto-save and auto-backups off for       
a while and see if        that improves things? The thing i find difficult       
about doing that is        remembering to save properly and frequently       
enough. With Base i        think it's also important to close properly.       
There is some        documentation and a handbook at[3]            
and the Faq at[4]            
might be able to        help too but the best place seems to be this mailing       
list or the Base        forums at Apache OpenOffice.       
Regards from       
Tom :)       
On 15 January 2014        07:30, Tom Davies <>[5]        wrote:       
Hi :)       
Errr, are you        using the internal back-end? You haven't connected to       
an external        back-end have you? You should really be keeping your data       
in an external        back-end instead of having the whole database as a       
single file.       
Being able to        do that is one of the main things that makes Base so       
much more        powerful than Access. The internal back-end got tacked on       
to make Base        more familiar to people who have picked up bad habits by       
using Access.        It seems to be a bit broken though. Annoyingly the       
Marketing        Mailing List and all our flyers, posters and leaflets (at       
least all the        ones that mention Base at all) keep pushing people into       
using the        internal back-end despite the fact that users have even       
experienced        data-loss by doing so. I'm tempted to ask you to take       
this problem to        the marketing list to get them to solve it but the       
experts in Base        are mostly on this list and will hopefully be able to       
help with this        issue.       
It should be        possible to export your existing tables into an external       
back-end and        this mailing list (note, not the marketing list) might be       
able to help        you with that.       
The next smart        thing about Base is that forms and reports can be, and       
are best made        in Writer or/and (i think) Calc. So normal users who       
are clueless        about databases can read the data in a familiar setting       
and use        familiar tools to format and edit things around the       
data-fields.        The forms and reports inside Base seem to be for       
data-entry and        people who have some clue about databases.       
However i have        never quite got around to getting to grips with all       
this. So        hopefully some of the experts might wade in and set me       
straight        (again)       
Regards from       
Tom :)       
On 15 January        2014 05:57, Vince Radice <>[2]        wrote:       
I am        running Fedora FC19-64 bit. Libreoffice Version:       
Build ID:       
Here are        some lines of a ls -la command       
-rw-------.        1 vince root 0 Dec 13 13:10 GRNew odb_0.odb       
-rw-------.        1 vince root 0 Dec 13 15:58 GRNew odb_1000.odb       
-rw-------.        1 vince root 0 Dec 13 15:58 GRNew odb_1001.odb       
-rw-------.        1 vince root 0 Dec 13 15:58 GRNew odb_1002.odb       
-rw-------.        1 vince root 0 Dec 13 15:58 GRNew odb_1003.odb       
-rw-------.        1 vince root 0 Dec 13 15:58 GRNew odb_1004.odb       
-rw-------.        1 vince root 0 Dec 13 15:58 GRNew odb_1005.odb       
-rw-------.        1 vince root 0 Dec 13 15:59 GRNew odb_1006.odb       
-rw-------.        1 vince root 0 Dec 13 15:59 GRNew odb_1007.odb       
-rw-------.        1 vince root 0 Dec 13 15:59 GRNew odb_1008.odb       
-rw-------.        1 vince root 0 Dec 13 15:59 GRNew odb_1009.odb       
-rw-------.        1 vince root 0 Dec 13 13:26 GRNew odb_100.odb       
-rw-------.        1 vince root 0 Dec 13 15:59 GRNew odb_1010.odb       
My database        name is GRNew,odb.       
I was        looking at some of the recent messages that were talking about       
looping        saving backups of untitled documents. It mentioned Calc and       
as being        involved. Could this be related to my problem?       
Vince        Radice       
On        01/14/2014 12:44 PM, Tom Davies wrote:       
Hi :)       
On        Ubuntu 12.04 i have no files in there. Do the file-names start       
with a        ~ or with "lock"? In either of those cases i think you can       
delete        the files without worry but it might be worth testing that for       
1 or 2        files.       
Going        off on a tangent i do have a non-LibreOffice folder with a load            
of        crash reports from when i don't close Xbmc properly and i       
delete        all of them from time-to-time. I'm not sure if this is       
or not.            
Regards        from       
Tom :)            
On 14        January 2014 04:12, Vince Radice _<>_        wrote:      
I        am seeing something and I don't know if it is a problem or       
       something I       
       have to live with.       
In        the ~/.config/libreoffice/4/user/backup directory, I have 3,000+            
       with 0 bytes. I assume that this means the files are empty.        There       
       files there which are not empty. The non-empty ones appear to be            
       files I have worked on. The empty files all appear to be        attempts       
a        Base database that I have created using the built in hsql        engine.       
       file is stored on my computer. The time stamps on the files are            
       There are 6 files with a time stamp of 15:58, 6 with 15:59, 6        with       
the        pattern continues for the other 3,500 empty files.       
       Does any one else have the same situation? I have the        save/backup       
the        general options set to 15 minutes.       
I        have a listing of all of the files if anyone wants to see it.       
       Thank you,       
       Vince Radice       
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