Re: [libreoffice-design] Templates, styles, outline and bullets/numbering

On 27/05/11 11:18 AM, Octavio Alvarez wrote:
> Hi, Steve!
>
> On Sun, 22 May 2011 17:25:09 -0700, Steve Edmonds
> <steve.edmonds@ptglobal.com> wrote:
> > The documentation at 
> > http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/cgi_img_auth.php/6/6e/0103GS3-StylesAndTemplates.pdf 
> > doesn't explain how they work and possibly if I can gain a better 
> > understanding I can update the wiki with a view to distilling the 
> > information I garner into something simple for the bulk of average 
> > users.
>
> Page 5 explains pretty much everything, I think.
>
> Maybe it is clearer to say it this way: styles set defaults for a "kind"
> of paragraph, so you can have all your titles look the same.
>
> You apply the paragraph style "Heading 1" to all your first-level
> headings. You can redefine the "Heading 1" with different attributes 
> (like
> bold and some top spacing) and you will see all of them being uniformly
> updated. If you don't apply any kind of direct formatting, all will look
> the same.
>
> For paragraph attributes (indents, tabs, spacing...) the computed
> attributes will be those applied by the paragraph style, overridden by
> whatever direct paragraph formatting (indents, etc.) you apply.
>
> For character attributes (bold, font size...) the computed attributes 
> will
> be those set by the paragraph style, overridden by those set by the
> character style, and then overridden by whatever direct formatting.
>
> Just consider the following: A style will inherit all undefined 
> attributes
> from its parent style (which, in turn, may inherit attributes from its 
> own
> parent style, up the way to Default).
>
> These are the basics, but should get you started. If you know HTML/CSS,
> styles are similar to classes.
>
> > As this ultimately may end up with design consequences, should the 
> > discussion be in one list or the other of both?
>
> Design, I think. Other people have suggested some ideas. Some good, some
> not so much.
>
> > To start with, what is the underlying construction of the document. 
> > It would seem that document features have styles associated. Do 
> > styles modify the document construction on application (or 
> > modification) of the style or do the styles work in layers like a 
> > filter.
>
> No, it's not that complicated. Paragraph styles are just a collection of
> formatting attributes (text flow attributes like "keep with next" are 
> also
> formatting attributes) that get defined with a name, and then, applied to
> any paragraph.
>
> Some functions may use styles, like, the Table of Contents field will use
> Contents 1 to N, and hyperlinks will use the Hyperlink style.
>
> > I.e. a line of text entered initially in a default document has a 
> > certain indent.
> > If I adjust the slider on the ruler it changes the indent. If I apply 
> > a paragraph style it changes the indent. Does applying the style 
> > change the basic indent value or override the basic value. If the 
> > style is removed, does the indent revert to the basic value.
>
> Two mistakes here.
>
> First, there is no "basic indent". If you do those steps in order, when
> you change the paragraph style indent you will not see any different
> because it is already overridden by whatever value you set by sliding the
> ruler.
>
> Second, styles don't get "removed". You are ALWAYS using a style. People
> who never apply styles will just be overriding the attributes from the
> "Default" style all over the document.
>
> > If I apply a paragraph style and then a list style, do these 
> > subsequently override the indent. Are they hierarchical so no matter 
> > what later change I make to the paragraph style my override by the 
> > last applied list style maintains the indent.
>
> I would say that those are not mixed, but I'm not sure about this. Try
> it for yourself.
>
> Hope this helps.
OK. The content of this thread has become a little fragmented. I started 
writing "Styles Usage" documentation for our users of LO and find there 
are inconsistencies requiring specific rules for my users dependent on 
the characteristic in question. Part of the aim is to avoid screwing up 
the formatting of manuals created with styles when editing.

For instance, I have a paragraph style style ABC.
1. I apply style ABC to some paragraphs.
2. If I indent a paragraph directly from the tool bar the indent 
persists through editing the paragraph style but is reset (overwritten) 
by applying ABC again to that paragraph.
3. If I change a section of font in a paragraph directly from the tool 
bar the changed font persists through editing the paragraph style and 
re-applying ABC again, it is not overwritten by reapplying the paragraph 
style as is the indent.

The above is true of LO 3.3.2. Should there be consistency or does the 
documentation need to detail the outcomes for every style attribute.

steve

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