Re: [libreoffice-users] Writer Callout Style settings

Hi Philip,

On 2021-07-25 16:04, Philip Jackson wrote:
> On 25/07/2021 15:49, John Kaufmann wrote:
> > On 2021-07-23 20:30, Regina Henschel wrote:
> > > Steve Edmonds schrieb am 18.07.2021 um 23:05:
> > > > ...
> > > > Is it possible to set Writer callout text paragraph style (or default settings, if so where please.
> > > > This is to avoid having to change the font and left hand offset in every line callout one at a time.
> > >
> > > No, it is not possible. Using the legacy callouts or the custom shape callouts makes no difference. 
> > > You get always a shape and in Writer neither for the shape itself nor for the text in the shape 
> > > styles are possible. You can only use direct formatting in Writer.
> >
> > Your distinction between legacy callouts and custom shape callouts implies that the basic idea has 
> > been around for some time, and special callout shapes were added later. Do you recall when it 
> > started, and at what point someone was moved to add custom shapes? In order to understand the issue 
> > (and any possible deficiencies) further, I would like to:
> >  (1) see the earliest Writer Guide and Help in which callouts are mentioned;
> >  (2) try to understand why special shapes were of more interest than style support;
> >  (3) try to understand the intended use of the "Callouts" toolbar, and why it has not been made 
> > visible;
> >  (4) try to understand when and why Vertical Callouts were added to the Drawing toolbar (but not 
> > made visible).
>
> I've been intrigued by this thread. Callouts was something I'd never heard of but I've now found 
> them quite useful. As far as documentation is concerned, I have an old file, 
> GS42-GettingStartedLO.pdf, from 2014 in which a search for 'callouts' gets several hits on 3 pages.

I don't have GS42, but do have GS60, and it seems the same: 6 instances of "callouts" and 1 
"callout" over 3 pages.


> The first says "For more information, see the Draw Guide Chapter 7 Getting Started with Draw, or the 
> Impress Guide Chapters 4, 5, and 6." ...

Check (p.183).


> The next says "Click on the triangle to the right of the Callouts icon to open the Callouts toolbar for 
> drawing".  So it would appear that the callouts toolbar is nothing more than a dropdown from the 
> callouts icon in the Drawing toolbar.

Check (p.212): Yes-though note that "Callouts" is not shown in View=>Toolbars.

Now I think I understand why: "Toolbar" is a generic term for two related entities: groupings of commands (like "Callout" and 
"Vertical Callout") and groupings of command /options/ (like "Callout Shapes", Flowchart Shapes", "Star Shapes", ...).  
Only groupings of *commands* are shown under View=>Toolbars.  Groupings of *command /options/* (what might be called 'option toolbars') are invoked only 
from their respective commands on the Drawing toolbar:
        Callouts        Basic Shapes    Lines and Arrows        Block Arrows
        Flowchart       Symbol Shapes   Curves and Polygons     Stars and Banners

[That answers my question (3) above.]


> The 3rd page just shows that there are 2 callout icons on the Drawing toolbar. In fact, in my copy 
> of Writer (6.4.7.2 in UbuntuStudio 20.04.2) there are those 2 icons, one with a dropdown list of  7 
> icons (the toolbar?) and the other a single icon which gives a simple rectangular callout shape.

Check (p.330): Yes-though note that a third callout icon ("Vertical Callouts") is shown under:
        View => Toolbars => Customize...  => Toolbars tab => <Target:Drawing>
It is:
> >         <Category:Drawing>        <Tooltip:"Vertical Callouts">   <Label:"Vertical Callouts">

Note that this command is enabled, but still does not show on the Drawing toolbar. So [question (4) 
above], why not?


Thanks for your reply, which nudged me a little closer to understanding this topic.  The fact that GS42 and 
GS60 are essentially identical in this regard (including the custom shapes, as opposed to what Regina called 
"the legacy callouts") suggests that finding the first mention of callouts [question (1) above] may 
not yield much additional information.  Still, it might be nice.  I am routinely amazed at how much lies 
beneath the surface of the LO project, waiting to be implemented or exploited.

Kind regards,
John

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