Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Customizing Number Format of each level in "Writer->Tools->Outline Numbering"

Hi :)
Ok, i had misunderstood due to some prejudices of my own.  


It is good to hear of a University that provides non-MS formats!  In my country it is hard-work 
trying to get them to accept anything else.   TeX is good.  TeX might do the outline numbering you 
want by default.  If you can use TeX it might be better than Writer.  it might let you copy&paste 
everything into TeX fairly easily?  If you are not already familiar with TeX (most people aren't 
and i'm one of them) then Writer should be able to do it.  I don't know how but others on the list 
might be able to help.  


Since you are already using Zotero and Writer it sounds like you are already using the best tools 
and already know plenty about them.  The link to Chapter 12 assumed you were just about to start 
writing rather than being well into the middle of it already.  

I am not sure how to do 
"
Even if I want to make a .odt specific version, I must be able to make "Figure" and "Table" 
numberings with Chapter numbers in themselves. How
could I do that?
"
but hopefully someone else might be able to give you a good answer later.  


The problem with going backwards and forwards between different formats is that sometimes you get 
extra codes/mark-up hidden inside the document.  Usually the best way is to keep "an original" in 
Odt and just edit that.  Obviously old versions and backups of it are a good plan!  Then make a 
copy of the document in Doc only when you need to show it to others.  Any changes made in Doc are 
probably better copy&pasted back into the original Odt.  it's not very convenient though!  
Hopefully everyone will be happy editing in Odt one day!  

I don't think that is the reason you are having troubles with numbering though and like you say it 
might well not have affected your document at all.


There are many countries where most people prefer to use pirated software rather than pay for it.  
It's good to see some places beginning to use OpenSource more to get out of that trap.  In my 
country i remember people being quite happy to use pirated software but now being keen to buy that 
software instead.  It might be just because i  am now working in a more corporate environment.  

Regards from 
Tom :)  





> ________________________________
> From: Sina Momken <digitsm@gmail.com>
> To: users@global.libreoffice.org 
> Cc: "users@global.libreoffice.org" <users@global.libreoffice.org> 
> Sent: Thursday, 25 July 2013, 11:09
> Subject: [libreoffice-users] Re: Customizing Number Format of each level in 
> "Writer->Tools->Outline Numbering"
>
>
> Dear Tom,
>
> Thank you for reading my question and trying to help.
>
> On 07/25/2013 01:17 PM, Tom Davies wrote:
> > Hi :)  
> > Sorry!  I couldn't find the section in the guides but you might find this helpful
> > https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Documentation/Publications#LibreOffice_Writer_Guide
>
> About the documentation and its chapter 12 I don't think it's useful for me now.
>
> > on a side issue you might find Chapter 12 interesting "Creating Tables
> of Contents, Indexes, and Bibliographies".  There is a
> plug-in/add-on/Extension that might help with that, i think "Zotero"?
> > http://www.zotero.org/support/word_processor_plugin_installation
>
> About Zotero, I currently use Zotero for making bibliography of my
> thesis. It's very convenient to use, integrates very well with
> LibreOffice and MS Word and is even better than its proprietary
> equivalent "Endnote".
>
> > How rigid is the template?  
> >
> > Can you create a fresh new Odt document in LibreOffice and follow the guidelines of the template 
> > without having to copy&paste anything from their template into your new document?  If there are 
> > bits you need to copy can you use paste-special to paste as unformatted text?  
> > Ctrl  Shift  v
> > rather than just 
> > Ctrl  v
>
> About using the template I can say that using the .doc template is not
> necessary and my university also has provided the TeX equivalent of that
> template, but not .odt format. However also using the specific .doc or
> .tex format is not necessary but my thesis must follow its guidelines
> (e.g. The fonts and sizes of headers, body, figs, tables, etc.)
> But fortunately I could successfully import and use the .doc template
> and only some minor problems like what I'm asking about is still
> present. Actually there is no need to create a new .odt file from
> scratch because most of the things work well.
>
> > A fresh start means you neatly avoid getting stuck with lots of legacy formatting codes that 
> > might spring surprises on you randomly in the future.  It gives you more control over what you 
> > do.  
>
> Even if I want to make a .odt specific version, I must be able to make
> "Figure" and "Table" numberings with Chapter numbers in themselves. How
> could I do that?
>
> > If it is rigid and you can't just start afresh then it might be worth asking the University if 
> > they could give you an OpenDocument Format (ODF, specifically Odt) version rather than the 
> > proprietary one.  If not then perhaps be insolent and ask them to buy and give you the product, 
> > that is made by a foreign company, in order to be able to use their template.  Perhaps push 
> > further and ask them to supply it in a non-American 'local' language.  
>
> About access to an MS Office instance, I don't have any problem in
> access to MS Windows, MS Office (the latest version) and many other Win
> software. I even currently have them but I don't use them because first
> my thesis needed some implementations in Linux, so it was hard to go
> back and forth to Windows, and second I don't believe in
> non-Free-Software at all.
>
> > Errr, i am guessing you are outside of the USA because most of the world is.  Also i assumed 
> > that your native language is not English (US) because, again, most of the world speaks other 
> > languages as their 1st language, even inside the US.  
>
> I live in Iran and believe it or not 99% of people here use the pirated
> version of the latest applications for windows. But even in this
> situation the trend to Free and Open Source Software is increasing and
> many Iranian People (like me) are exclusively using FOSS software. This
> increasing trend is usually because of the Freedom and Capabilities that
> the FOSS applications and their community bring. It's not matter of
> money (because we don't buy software here!); I use LO because I believe
> in Free Software and the community around it.
>
> > Also note that ODF is an ISO standard.  ISO meaning it is agreed by an international agency made 
> > from people of many different nationalities.  While DocX also has a version that is an ISO 
> > standard that is not the one implemented in any version of MS Office so far because they all 
> > tweak it some different way that is non-compliant with the standards.  
>
> Actually the template I have is in .doc format not .docx. And
> surprisingly LO Writer works very well with .doc format even better than
> .docx format. I prefer to continue my work in .doc format because it
> renders well enough in LO in addition to MS Word; But .odt format
> doesn't represent well in MS Word. So it's safe for me to stay with .doc
> so if I needed to go back to MS Word I would encounter less issues.
>
> > Point out that you already have the necessary tools for the job but the only reason you would 
> > have to buy product from a foreign company is to complete this 1 task, the thesis.  The tools 
> > you already have do everything else better.  
>
> You are right, the tools I already have do everything better and it's
> the main reason I don't go back to MS Word unless as the last solution.
> But I think it's possible for me to complete my thesis using only LO
> Writer and I believe the Outline Numbering problem can be solved. If I
> become able to completely port the .doc template to LibreOffice, I'll
> save it as .odt and I'll publish it on my website and also give it back
> to my university for usage in the future.
>
> > Regards from 
> > Tom :)
> >
> >
> >
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: Sina Momken <digitsm@gmail.com>
> > > To: users@global.libreoffice.org 
> > > Sent: Thursday, 25 July 2013, 8:39
> > > Subject: [libreoffice-users] Customizing Number Format of each level in "Writer->Tools->Outline 
> > > Numbering"
> > >
> > >
> > > Hello, I need help with LibreOffice Writer -> Tools -> Outline Numbering.
> > >
> > > As long as I know Tools -> Outline Numbering in LibreOffice Writer is
> > > somehow equivalent to defining new Multilevel list in MS Office Word 2010.
> > > But I need some features in formatting of each level in Outline
> > > Numbering, which is not available in LibreOffice Writer but is available
> > > in MS Word -> Multilevel list. I need some more professional formatting
> > > of each level because I'm writing my thesis based on a template provided
> > > by my university and I have to obey that template. In that template
> > > (which is a .doc file) format of each level is defined in a particular
> > > way that can be shown correctly in MS Word, but not in LibreOffice.
> > > I need to be able to customize Number format of each level similar to MS
> > > Word like what you can see here:
> > >
> > > http://cybertext.wordpress.com/2010/06/22/word-2007-taming-multilevel-list-numbering/
> > >
> > > If someone is professional in this issue please help me.
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