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While I understand it has glitches I actually like the sidebar. In Impress I like being able to see and set the object properties without opening a popup. That said, I wonder if sidebars would be best split off to extensions. I could see installing a sidebar for Impress while someone else might install a formatting sidebar for Writer. This doesn't really address your concerns about hidden gems. It might actually make that problem worse. It just seems to me that when some people are complaining that they don't want a feature and others do want it, extensions are a natural answer.

Derek Cooper

On 02/07/2014 01:00 PM, Jean-Francois Nifenecker wrote:
Le 07/02/2014 12:50, Mirek M. a écrit :
Hi guys,
I feel like the conversation has shifted to styles vs. direct formatting,
which really isn't the crux of the sidebar problem.

Yes, it does, at least in part, given the current state of the Sidebar.
We can only discuss on what we see currently. And yes we may propose
amending the Sidebar for a better UI.

My main griefs with the Sidebar are: (1) it takes a lot of screen estate
without introducing any new idiom, IMO (2) the Sidebar buttons are
docked vertically which (a) makes it wider than necessary and (b) is not
consistent with other UI items, such as the Stylist; (3) I need the
Taskbar in Impress, which is replaced by the Sidebar (so far so good,
with the notes above), but I do *not* want it in Writer: make it
optional on a module basis (just like the Navigator and Stylist should
be, btw).

(BTW, the Properties
pane of the sidebar is very likely to feature styles in the future.)

About Styles. This is somewhat OT but requires a *deep* thinking from
TDF. The root question is: *who* is the LibreOffice installation target?

-- Business and Corporate users?
Why, then, is the tool un-finished when the installation is done? No
Stylist, No Navigator. Missing settings. All these are hidden. If no-one
in the company IT dept knows how much efficiency can be pulled from
LibO, these gems stay hidden. This explains why thousands of users are
indeed struggling against the tool while LibO is designed to help them.
That's a real, real, shame. On a side note, this doesn't help getting
market shares from these targets. From some pov the current office
suites (unfortunately LibO is not alone), make me feel they are toys
until someone takes some time to configure them before giving them to
the in-house users. And I can tell you many IT depts won't ever change
one single bit after LibO has been installed. The user is left alone.

-- John Doe?
Ok, fine with me. But then give the businesses and corporate users a
tool, a preset, something, to help them setting LibO to fit the
efficiency their users need.

Currently the answer to this question is John Doe.

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