Re: Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Proposal for the "Cross-Reference" dialog

Hi Paolo, all,

just copying your mail from the archive in here, because I lost your original 
mail (see my other mail sent from a wrong account so it needs some time for 
approval, I guess)!

Paolo wrote:
> I have done some progress in the Fields dialog (or Cross-Reference, as 
previously referred).Some points we must take into account, beyond what 
already said by Bjorn and me, is the number of clicks needed to complete a 
task versus how easy is to do them (by easy, I mean the distance between the 
two clicks and how clear is their visibility on the screen). Thinking about 
it, I made two mock-ups in HTML & CSS to the Wizard proposal. I just made the 
first step suggested by Björn, so there is not options for each task yeat.
> You can interact with them in:
> http://linkedej.com.br/libreofice-paulo/LibreOffice-Fields-Mockup-1.html
> http://linkedej.com.br/libreofice-paulo/LibreOffice-Fields-Mockup-2.html
> (Just tested in Firefox and Chrome)
>
> The first proposal has in the first step just 2 task options: Set a field & 
Insert a field. The second step allow to set the field type and configure its 
proprieties. Done!
> The second proposal has in the first step the choose of field type in each 
task (Set and Insert). The second step just allow to configure the field 
proprieties. Done!
> In the Proposal 1, each task takes 2 or 3 clicks to be done. In the Proposal 
2, 2 clicks ever. But think is easier complete a task inProposal 1 than 2 
because it takes more time to look all possibilities now in the first step 
than just choose between 2 actions and then refine your choice.
> If there is any a better way to present the Step 1 in the Proposal 2, 
keeping its 2 clicks and allowing easy to eye choise, I'd like to know. :D
> Björn, I hope one of these proposals fit to your ideas. otherwise, please 
say me then I make a new mockup. :) I'd like to know your opinion on our next 
steps.

First of all: Thank you - great work! 

Your mocks point us to the unsolved fundations I wanted to work on today, but 
unfortunately won't come to. But I will spend a couple of hours in a train 
tomorrow, so I am optimistic I get to some results then.

The fundations we need to understand, before we can actually find a really 
good interface solution is a clustering of the different types of fields. You 
have done the clustering by "New" and "Existing". I am not 100% convinced this 
is the best clustering, because it is too general. 

I would like to find someting between perhaps 5 to 10 (ideal would be 7 - 
remember the limitations in the human short term memory) categories, the user 
can decide in the first step. Each presenting again 5 to 10 fields that in the 
next step can be configured (would give us room for up to 100 different types 
of fields we can add to LibO, so making this a sustainable solution for 
whatever kind of fields will be added in the future). 

My main problem here is, that I do not understand all types of fields 
available - which would be very helpful if trying to find a decent 
clustering...

Additionally we should introduce some comfort functionallity like a filter 
mechanism, recently used or perhaps even favorite fields for quick retrival of 
the wanted fields.

Summing it up: Version 2 is much better than version 1, but still leaves room 
for further improvement.

Ok, more - including some mocks and a suggestion for a clustering - hopefully 
tomorrow.

Best,
Björn

Am Dienstag, 25. Januar 2011, 14:11:39 schrieb Paulo José:
> Hi Björn! :)
>
> On 24-01-2011 14:26, Björn Balazs wrote:
> > My appologies for not stronger pointing to this being a thread. But I
> > think this:
> > [...]
> > is not a waste of time, because you had the time to get to know this
> > dialogue much better and hey - we need to iterate towards a good
> > solution anyhow.
>
> Yeah, you're totally right! :D
>
> > So how can this dialogue be improved?
> >
> > I think the approach of a tabbed interface is wrong in the first place.
> > Why?
> >
> > What do user do in here? They want to INSERT a field / variable etc. or
> > CONFIGURE the set field.
>
> I would include that user can insert Databases to document. Perhaps this
> should not be here... :)
>
> > What will user NOT do in here? User do not want to change a set field to
> > something totally different in this dialogue. If they want to do so,
> > they can simply delete the set field and add a new one.
>
> For sure! ;) Great point!
>
> > What is the conclusion? 1. We need to make it as easy as possible to
> > find the right field for the user.  2. We need to make it as easy as
> > possible to configure the set field (e.g. update the date in a fixed
> > date field).
>
> Yeah, and it includes make it easier to user search and finds an
> existent reference (or another field), like Cedric initially had
> pointed, because could be many of them in a big document.
>
> > How can we achieve this?
> > 1. We need a wizard, that really helps the user to find the field he
> > needs. This is basically the content included in the tabs and in the
> > "Type" column. Also some content of the "Select" column would be of
> > relevance (e.g. the Select column for Type==Sender or Type==Statistics
> > should rather be included in the wizard, while the Select Column of
> > Type==Date or Type==Author would rather be part of step 2.
>
> I got it. It means these fields that have 3 steps to complete (Sender,
> Statistics) could be complete by 2 steps. Great! :) Although, it's
> important find a way to don't bloat  the first step and make it clear.
>
> > 2. For each Field the user can insert we need a specialized dialogue
> > that
> > allows to intuitively configure the content of the field. Perhaps we
> > need to allow some interaction like: remove the field and start the
> > wizard again to insert a new field without loosing relevant formating
> > options - but I am not sure about that.
> >
> > So, Paulo - and anyone else interested:
> >
> > I guess we should start with step 1. How should a wizard look like that
> > allows the user to comfortabely select the wanted field? This wizard
> > should be capable to add any new functionality that can possible make
> > it into LibO at any time. It should be informative, so the user knows
> > wether he has found the right field and it could make suggestions about
> > any related field, the user might be searching for.
>
> Yeah, by informative I think it could present some short, friendly and
> objective text about the possibilities of this dialog. Would be great
> allow to user preview the result, to make sure he gets what he wants
> before complete the wizard. If the user make any step wrong or changes
> its mind, should be easy change any step of wizard, no need to start all
> steps again.
>
> I'm thinking about a wizard gradually filling with options the dialog,
> and emphasizing the current step. Under all, a preview box showing the
> result. Each step could present some informations and along the process,
> they could be changed to better helps the user. Will be great if the
> user can't need to use Help to complete this wizard, and I totally agree
> with you about it should be intuitive, above all.
>
> > Once we have a solution for this, we can then make our way through the
> > individual dialogues needed to present the different kind of fields
> > (2.).
> >
> > What do you think? Please provide mocks that we can discuss!
>
> Alright, I will try to work on some mock-ups and then show them to
> community discuss. :D Björn, you really gave great suggestions and made
> a good summary of what we should do. Thank you! :D
>
> Best,
> ~Paulo

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