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On 2022-12-08 18:13, Toki wrote:
In Islam:
* The new day begins at sunset.
* The new month begins at sunrise, after the new moon has been sighted.

Judaism, is slightly more logical. Both the new day and new month begin at sunset.
The new month begins on the sunset of the day that the new moon was sighted.

By way of example.
Sunset is at 5:00 PM  on Thursday.
The New moon is sighted at 5:10 PM on Thursday.
In Islam, the first of the month starts at sunrise on Friday.
In Judaism, the first of the month starts at sunset on Friday.
(If you want to be technical, replace _Judaism_ with _Karaite Judaism_.)

When going through journals of pious Muslims, you will occasionally see dates like 30 Shaʿbān 12th 
hour immediately followed by 1 Ramaḍān 13th hour.The first through twelfth hour doesn't exist for 1 
This is why knowing what assumptions are made about the converted date are important.

When I found the questions interesting, I did not imagine how interesting: that the last day of 
each month is also the first day of the following month -- not just for Shaʿbān to Ramadan, but for 
all monthly transitions. The implications are fascinating.

That said, your use of "12th hour" suggests that "sunset" and "sunrise" are (like Gregorian 
"midnight") formal based on a 24-hour day, not literal - correct?

[Sorry that you came to the list for answers, and ended up providing answers. Sadly, the topic is 
esoteric, but it is important.]

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