Re: [libreoffice-users] fyi: Java dependance, and others

The last I heard, admittedly many years ago for Access 1.x, MS Access 
uses the JET database server, which is bundled with Access much like 
Base uses HSQLDB by default.  However, you are correct in that MS makes 
it difficult to connect the Access front-end to an external database 
server, but that is their business model.

It is a bit for users to grasp.  Especially when the Base documentation 
talks of everything as a "database" when there are several separate 
elements involved.  The term database, in my opinion, refers to the disk 
files containing the data.  Those files are accessed by the database 
"_Server_", sometimes called the "Back-End".  Base is one of many 
"_Client_"s, sometimes called the "_Front End_", that communicate with 
the server to access data and format it in human-readable form.  IMHO, 
some such explanation should be in the first paragraphs (introduction) 
of the Base manual, but it is not in the 11/30/11 version I read 
lately.  There is an introduction, but it is not very enlightening for 
first-time users with little or no database system experience.  
Continuing to refer to these element names throughout the manual, where 
applicable, would do much to educate the users instead of using the 
generic, all-encompassing term "database".  A block diagram may also be 
of benefit:

   Database File(s) <-> Server [<-> Driver] <-> Client <-> user

Where:
Database File(s) are the actual data files on the disk.
Server is one of MySQL, HSQLDB, POSTGRESQL, JASPER, etc.
"Driver" is an optional interface between the server and client and in 
the case of MySQL would be "mysql-connector-java" for example.
"Client" is the front-end, or interface between the user and the 
server.  In this case, Base.

You may be forgetting that the Base Oracle Report Builder is known to be 
Java-based, which is a big chunk of Base in my opinion.  Also from the 
manual, page 5, under "What Is Base?" - "HSQLDB is written in Java."

Girvin Herr



Tom Davies wrote:
> Hi :)
> Some interesting articles and comments on 4.0.0.  Not all completely precisely accurate and quite a 
> lot of the comments are clearly either deliberate FUD or hopelessly confused people that need help. 
>  There are some gems in there though and i liked this one in ArsTechnica
>
> "
>
> DannyB | Wise, Aged Ars Veteran
>
> about 10 hours ago  
>
> "scuttle22 wrote: So now Libre Office depends on Java AND Python."
>
> >From a Slashdot post that I saw:
> http://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?si ... d=42822061
>
> To be precise, as computed by sloccount, libreoffice-4.0.0.3.tar.xz contains:
>
> cpp: 3990644 (87.04%)
> java: 400958 (8.75%)
> ansic: 91036 (1.99%)
> perl: 42456 (0.93%)
> python: 17392 (0.38%)
> sh: 17256 (0.38%)
> yacc: 8228 (0.18%)
> cs: 6648 (0.15%)
> asm: 3269 (0.07%)
> objc: 2602 (0.06%)
> lex: 2030 (0.04%)
> awk: 907 (0.02%)
> pascal: 800 (0.02%)
> csh: 235 (0.01%)
> lisp: 115 (0.00%)
> php: 104 (0.00%)
> sed: 7 (0.00%)
>
> However, as Desler said, the Java bits are actually optional.
> "
>
> It seems that a common misunderstanding is that people often seem to think Base is completely dependant on Java and that Base is used by everyone.  Neither is really true.  
>
> Base seems best when connecting to an external back-end and it's much easier to do that with Base than with Access.  Base really pushes people into using an external source of data.  If you choose a java-based back-end then Base will effectively be using java.  If you choose a non-java back-end then it wont [shrugs].  I guess that is really difficult for people to grasp.  
>
> I guess the misunderstanding arises because Access uses an internal back-end for it's data so people try to force Base to use it's own back-end too instead of doing something sensible.  To be fair i am doing exactly that too.  Bases internal back-end uses java.  
>
> Hmmm, i can see myself running into a problem now that i have uninstalled java from all works machines!  Time for me to be a bit more sensible and work at migrating the data tables to a decent external back-end.  (There are a couple of old posts that should be able to help me so no worries there)   
>
> So, the main thing i found interesting was the breakdown of different percentages of languages used 
> in LibreOffice.  My guess is that non C++ is gradually being replaced by C++ but there's still 
> 12.94% left with most of that being java which is mostly in easily avoidable wizards and Extensions.
> Regards from
> Tom :)  
>
>   

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