Re: remarks about development wiki / LODE

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Hi Thorsten,

sorry for the TLDR mail, but this has to be out.

On 05.04.2018 00:09, Thorsten Behrens wrote:
> Hi Jörg,
>
> thanks for the feedback, and great to hear you got LibreOffice
> building!
>
> Jörg Kubitz wrote:
> > |4. Supported Platforms: What about windows? This document is about
> > installing in windows but it doesnt say which windows Version but lis
ts
> > MacOs Versions.
> Well, it lists cygwin there - that should imply Windows?<rant>
I do not want to nitpick, but I do many, many, MANY Windows devs in thei
r
separated world, who even do not know revision tools (not ever heard of
git), nor compilers except VC or even stranger stuff. If this "tutorial"
is for newbees, then tell them that Windows 7+ is supported, otherwise
some might come with an old Windows XP or even stranger system. Do not
ask, I have experienced very strange stuff in the paid-windows-world
with their many bubbles where everybody knows each other groups (around
one product); do believe me: their are many products (not only from MS,
but in general) with their own bubble!

> So lode is the closest we have to that goal thus far. Perhaps you
> would be interested in starting such an effort? I believe chocolatey
> could be a starting point, they do provide visual studio, JDK etc
> install targets, and seem to be reasonably well maintained.
>
> Be warned though, that just like lode and the wiki page, this will be
> a moving target.
Well again: I will have to setup a windows VM in the next few days for
getting LibO build on Windows on my own. I always did that on a Linux
because of the knowledge that windows is undocumented.

In the end this situation is because of a missing motivation to keep the
requirements on track. Doesn't matter where: buildbots, tinderboxes,
google fuzz, cloph (release), wiki, scripts, etc... Mostly a simply
message to the ml is missing. (This is just an observation by mainly
non-dev / non-builder; just a reader of wiki, irc, mailing lists, etc;
exception this week about font-python stuff)

> > Or even supply a preconfigured VM image or Docker Container would be
> > nice.
> We have that for Linux (in the cloud, on request), and there's some
> initial looking into janitor.technology. For Windows, we obviously
> cannot legally distribute such a thing.
Docker would maybe possible with the latest (TM) Windows 10 stuff.



Thorsten, don't get me wrong. I do not say that this is your fault, it's
just your words in that mail why I have to write that. I know you and
many of others the crowd. I know that happens too easily (by accident,
or well, not getting paid for!). I see that problem from outside
(similar I have with my own company, and nobody is listening!) - This is
more a general problem not willing to write at least a few minutes to a
ML hoping this can be found on google; maybe pinging at least
buildbots-owners to know that they have to install stuff , well or
simply to help newcomers because they will might help you in a half year
(or not!).

For this a general overview is often missing. (This is not a rant saying
the TDF should do that, this is simply a rant!)

</rant>


I would love to talk you this weekend, but sadly I cannot come to
Hamburg as I'm having another appointment on Saturday in Frankfurt. :-(

> Cheers,
>
> -- Thorsten
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