Re: [libreoffice-design] A new User paradigm for LibreOffice.

Hello Astron

Thanks for an interesting and informative reply.

> I believe, with your script, you'd best go to the developer list at
> [1] which is always quite enthusiastic about patches etc. As far as I
> know there is quite some interest in automatic PDF conversion.

OK, that certainly encourages me.

> Also, maybe take a look at ODF-Toolkit [2] (now also at Apache) which
> is designed to (AFAICS) to manipulate ODF programmatically.

Great. I wasn't sure whether I was heading down a dead-end alley.

> Right... the problem is that LibO is a very complicated network of
>  :
> must be loaded to do anything productive.

I'd figured that this was probably the case. Given that you respond well  
to odd suggestions, I'd like to say a few words here that will surely get  
a hostile reception in most quarters. I'd better warn you that I'm a  
retired hardware engineer and a reluctant convert to coding - a.k.a a  
grumpy old man. When young, my generation faced a much brighter prospect -  
a broad, unexplored field with no roads, no maps, and only a few tracks  
leading to uncertain destinations - freedom and exploration beckoned  
excitingly. Today's young developers face a crowded highway heading in a  
direction that many (myself included) do not like, and enclosed between  
walls to hide the open prospect. Turn-offs are few, and discouraged.

The comprehensive, mature code-base that is OO/LO is certainly a valuable  
inheritance, but defines and largely delimits the creative possibilities  
open to younger would-be explorers. It's always more exciting to devise  
and develop something brand new than to maintain and refine an established  
product. One result is that new versions now tend to be less useful or  
appealing than earlier versions, being the result of a need for novelty  
rather than a response to requirements.

I believe that there is a way forward through this sticking-point, but it  
requires a fair bit of preliminary tedium. I've long suspected that most  
of the big apps and OS components are now such an impenetrable maze of  
dependencies and undocumented code that maintenance is a chore, and  
further development increasingly difficult. To go back over these acres of  
code, reorganizing and rewriting them where necessary, is obviously an  
unexciting prospect, but it may be the best way to reveal new  
possibilities. One of the confident criticisms leveled at the Open Source  
movement back in the 80s and 90s was that, without financial incentive, no  
sane person would devote the time needed to create an OS and major apps  
from scratch. I entertained such doubts myself, and was both amazed and  
delighted at what had been achieved by the turn of the century. It is, in  
fact, one of the greatest of modern social achievements, but gets no  
official recognition - much less praise - since it completely refutes the  
corporate rationale and philosophy.

Self-praise is always ugly to behold, but the Open Source movement  
certainly deserves far more recognition than it gets, especially by way of  
educating young people about its achievements and future potential. I  
believe that it is time for all Open Source developers to "take a break",  
to sit back and reflect on what they've achieved and inherited, and  
consider some alternative routes into the future, rather than being  
increasingly driven by corporate competition down corporate highways. If  
it's not too abstract a suggestion, I believe that Open Source needs to  
expand laterally rather than vertically. OO/LO is just one case in point;  
I'm still using KDE 3.5 because 4.5 is a glitzy dog of a desktop that is  
much less usable and intuitive than its predecessor, and there are many  
others who share this opinion. End of rant.

> There are some ideas how to present LibO on e.g. Android [3], yet of
>  :
> certainly highly welcome.

I'm very much a Philistine when it comes to the whole mobile thing, mainly  
because I believe it's being driven almost solely by corporate interests  
and wrong-headed social philosophy, so for the moment I've little to offer  
in this regard, and almost no experience of it.

> PS: Sorry for the long list of references, but there were many points
> you wanted to discuss. :)

Not at all - much appreciate the time and detail.

All the best
Carl

--
Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+help@global.libreoffice.org
Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/
All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted