Re: [libreoffice-users] Printing serial letters

On 12/10/14 07:28 PM, Dave Barton wrote:
> Gary Dale wrote:
> > On 12/10/14 06:27 AM, Dave Barton wrote:
> > > > > Gary,
> > > > > Please add a reproducible example to Heinrich's report. This will:
> > > > > a) Assist QA in assessing if it is the same bug or not.
> > > > > b) Add more weight to the issue, which in turn is more likely to
> > > > > attract
> > > > > a developer's interest.
> > > > > If you know it's not the exactly the same issue and your reference to
> > > > > "messing up colors" suggests that it may not be, please find and
> > > > > contribute to an existing report, or open a new one.
> > > > > Nobody (developer, QA or other) "denies the existence of an issue", but
> > > > > no issue can be effectively resolved if it cannot be replicated and
> > > > > it's
> > > > > cause determined. Which is where we come in with accurate reports and
> > > > > reproducible examples.
> > > > >
> > > > > This list is a great place to vent our frustrations about our "pet"
> > > > > issues, but at the end of the day our "rants" here do nothing, only our
> > > > > contributions (ie. bug reports and reproducible examples) will help to
> > > > > get anything done.
> > > > >
> > > > > Dave
> > > > I've already done everything you asked and more,
> > > No, I have not asked you to do anything, except provide a pointer to the
> > > location where the details of the issue could be found.
> > Actually you asked for a reproducible example, which I've already
> > provided, along with screen shots showing the bug.
> No, at that time you had given no information about any report you may
> have made. Only later did you come forward with a bug report number.
I've done what you asked already by providing the developers with the 
information.

> > > > including sending screen shots to demonstrate that the problem is
> > > > with LibreOffice and not something else.
> > > Where are these screen shots? There are no attachments to bug 83346.
> > That's because bugzilla refuses to take e-mail from me. I can send bug
> > reports via reportbug but it doesn't want to take e-mail sent via
> > icedove, probably due to the way it reads addresses - ignoring the
> > reply-to and only using the from field.
> I don't understand what you mean about emailing into Bugzilla. I have
> been using the Bugzilla software for over a decade and to the best of my
> knowledge it does not accept email input. If you know differently please
> enlighten me.
Of course bugzilla, like other bug tracking systems, takes e-mail 
responses to bugs. The problem is that the way LibreOffice's bugzilla is 
set up, it rejects messages where the "from" sender is not registered 
with the message "There is no user named '<e-mail address>'. Either you 
mis-typed the name or that user has not yet registered for a Bugzilla 
account." In this it differs from other list response systems that take 
any "from" information. This doesn't work for people who use e-mail 
forwarders as permanent addresses that forward to whatever mail account 
they have with their current ISP.

> > > > If you look in the print dialogue, it shows that
> > > > LibreOffice thinks it is printing 2N-1 pages instead of N pages. And no,
> > > > this is not the "print automatically inserted blank pages" "feature".
> > > There is no way for others to determine if this is true without details
> > > (eg. samples, screen shots, etc.)
> > You can get them directly from developer Cor Nouws. The fact that he
> > failed to attach them to the bug report suggests that he doesn't see the
> > problem.
> No I can't get them from Cor. I don't know if he is a developer or not,
> but either way it is your issue and you opened the report, so if you
> wanted to get your issue resolved it is your responsibility to make the
> necessary information available on Bugzilla where others can evaluate it.
If the developers want to get information about potential problems with 
their code, they need to ensure that it is easy and convenient for 
people to report them.

> > > > The reason I think it is probably the same bug is that in both cases
> > > > LibreOffice doesn't initiate the new page properly. I guess in
> > > > monochrome it chews up some text while in colour it mangles the colour
> > > > coding.
> > > It does not necessarily follow that similar issues come from the same
> > > section of the (very large) code base. I have seen numerous examples
> > > where changes to one part of the code has an unexpected impact on an
> > > apparently unrelated function.
> > Perhaps but the odds are against the same effect having two separate
> > causes.
> The odds are very much in favour of it having a separate cause, because
> Heinrich now reports that his issue has been resolved in a more recent
> version.
Thanks for the heads up. I don't do form letters every day. I just 
checked and it appears to working on my system too.

> > > > My latest bug report on it was 83346. I sent the samples to Cor Nouws
> > > > who closed the bug after deciding that it was a "feature" that no sane
> > > > person would ask for - the mangling of colours. Apparently he didn't
> > > > note that "feature" he thought it was, was actually a symptom of the
> > > > problem I was reporting.
> > > There is no way of determining if Cor was right or wrong if the samples
> > > you refer to are not made publicly available (eg. Bugzilla).
> > >
> > > At this stage I am not going to reopen the report, but if you want to
> > > reply to https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=83346#c2 I am
> > > prepared to work with you on this. Please do not send anything directly
> > > to me.
> > >
> > > I am not an active developer, but if this can be demonstrated as an
> > > issue that needs fixing, it can be brought to the attention of the
> > > developers.
> > Again, blame Cor for not attaching them. So long as bugzilla doesn't
> > take legitimate followups, I can't do much. I'd like to send you the
> > e-mail I sent him but if you're not willing to accept it, I'm stymied.
> Why do you want to "blame" anyone"? Of course Bugzilla accepts follow
> ups. I added a follow up (see the link above) to your report and you can
> do the same by simply following that link and logging in. You must
> already have log-in credentials or you could not have made the report in
> the first place. The reason I said don't send things to me directly was
> because the information needed to be made readily available to anyone
> who was prepared to evaluate and possibly work on your issue.
So why didn't Cor post the follow-up? He has the same information.
> > > > BTW: I also fail to see why anyone would think that inserting blank
> > > > pages between form letters is a feature that should be on by default. I
> > > > print a lot of different types of form letters and have never found any
> > > > use for it. If it's useful to someone, leave it in but don't enable it
> > > > by default.
> > > In your case it may not serve any purpose, but I have assisted a number
> > > of book authors in using Writer to create their manuscripts. In those
> > > and other similar situations this is an extremely useful option. Few
> > > others are likely to see this as an issue, since it is a "user
> > > definable" global option. While we would all like things to work
> > > "straight out of the box" exactly the way we want, in reality the best
> > > we can ask/hope for is an option to configure our specific requirements.
> > As I said, I'm not asking for the feature to be removed, although I
> > don't really see how form letters help authors create manuscripts, but
> > rather for it to not be enabled by default. I suggest that there are a
> > lot more business users creating form letters than there are authors
> > creating manuscripts. And for almost anyone, having spurious blank pages
> > inserted into the output is not what they want. As a global default, it
> > should be unchecked, not checked.
> Why are you talking about form letters helping authors create
> manuscripts? If you fully understood how the software can be used to
> prepare manuscripts for publication you would realise these are not
> "spurious" blank pages. The software can be used for the creation of
> many different types of documents. Form letters and manuscripts are just
> two unrelated types that can be created.
The misplaced default shows up in form letters and mailing labels. I've 
never had it in other documents I've prepared, where it would be 
unchecked by default. I've only seen it checked when printing form 
letters and labels.

> > It's possible that this "feature" is related to the bug because both
> > cause interspersed blank pages that show up in the page count in the
> > print dialogue.
> No it appears that they are not related, see above.
>
> Since you appear to only want to argue with someone who was willing to
> try and assist and blame others, I have no further interest in this issue.
No it appears they were related. It's finally been fixed years after I 
filed the original bug report. Now if only they would fix the label 
printing problem where columns are set using label width instead of 
horizontal pitch. This is another issue I've tired of reporting only to 
see it ignored.


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