Tom C.I generally don't disagree with you concerning human relations. However, I don't want *all* of my human interactions to be as emotionally connected as you seem to imply.
I have my family and close intimate friends, with whom I communicate directly, and rarely through e-communication.
I then I have my church family, with whom I am open emotionally, but not as much as with my genetic family.
Then there are e-mail lists of a more personal subject matter on which I will share more openly.
But, this is a techno-geek lists. It exists *primarily* to help users learn how to get the most out of LO. While I appreciate the interaction on this list, I won't deceive myself into thinking that this is an emotionally intimate support system. By it's nature, it can't be, nor do I think it is intended to be.
Virgil On 5/21/2014 5:49 PM, Tom Cloyd wrote:
Anne, Virgil, Tom,I only just saw this thread, thanks to Anne's restarting it. I wish I could follow this list more closely, but I just can't. This thread matters to me, however, so I feel compelled to jump in.Tom, and all - Your initial post is probably the most courageous, human, and gripping thing I've ever read on this list. I've always had a strong sense that you are much in touch with your valuing other people, and your awareness of them, and of yourseflf. In these things, you are in my estimation exceptional. Does this confer a kind of vulnerability? Surely. But the show is worth the cost of the ticket. You lead by example, without question, and I love that example!It is an undeniable fact that we are social animals. Remove that from us and we become mute, because we no longer have a common language. We also likely become naked (ready for that?) and tool-less (ouch - no computers!!!). Going the other direction, a society of robots sounds unrewarding in the very areas that typically end up mattering most to most of us, especially at critical times - like the death of a child, or when confronting an apparently unsolvable problem, or when encountering our own finiteness.I don't want impersonal relations. I want people in my life. I can easily predict that virtually everyone else does too. People are more than data and intelligence and decisions. We have bodies and feelings, smiles and laughter and tears. I want all of that. Don't you? I'll bet you do.Being "different" is an interesting fate, and also as much illusion as fact. Two issues arise rather quickly, and they aren't often enough distinguished: self-acceptance and acceptance by others. I can (for those who are interested) give some exceptionally persuasive references in support of the proposition that these two issues are VERY intimately related - most particularly in our early years.When adult, it may be hoped (but hardly always achieved) that we are self-supporting enough to be only modestly reliant on acceptance from others. But must of us still need at least SOME of this, and fairly routinely. I know I do. However, there is this qualification: my computer accepts me all the time (well, most of the time). But I never get a hug. My friends, acquaintances, and clients accept me most of the time, too, but offer so much more, including hugs. I may spend more hours with my computer, but I prefer my friends, acquaintances, and clients....and now to Virgil - I think there is some truth to what you say, and it has to do with this: When dealing with problems, which is what we do most of the time here, keeping the level of affect (feelings) produced in our brain moderated allows our perceptions and cerebral cortex to function unimpaired by the disruptions that are caused by affective excess. But who wants primarily to dialog with a computer? Or a robot? And who wants to be up in their cerebral cortex all the time? Is that what your wife wants from you? Your kids? Your dog? You? You know the answer.Well, I'm like your dog. I want more. I think that if the truth be known we all do.Yeah, I suspect that more than a few here are exceptionally developed relative to problem solving skills, and possibly less developed in supportive, rewarding social relations skills. So...with that awareness in mind, let's just work a bit at keep all of ourselves involved here. Tom D. did, when he told his story. Practice make better.Anne - yeah, you're right. That's one reason why I have never ever used an avatar on the Internet, unless I was doing an investigation of some ill-behaved person and needed to move unseen. You can go to my professional website and get my phone number (or nabble, and look at my signature block). This is who I am, and it's never been a problem. I strongly dislike avatars. If you cannot stand out where I can see you, you'd better have a darned good reason.If it were me, no one on this list would be here without an email address to which a name and phone number was attached. Just grow up, people!One off-topic final note: I'm not finished with the bullying issue. It relates in several ways to much of what I've already said. I'm working on a blog post that will make this clear. I'll bring the link to the list, when it's ready. I've been slow getting to it, as there are many alligators in my swamp just now.t. On 05/21/2014 01:41 PM, anne-ology wrote:On the other hand, this anonymity is the reason these criminal types(hackers, spammers/scammers, ...) are able to roam 'round - with no fears of being caught ;-(For that reason, many of us are wary - maybe even overly cautious;-) From: Virgil Arrington <cuyfalls@hotmail.com> Date: Tue, May 20, 2014 at 6:25 AM Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] non-mainstream To: users@global.libreoffice.org On 05/19/2014 07:42 AM, Tom Davies wrote: Hi :)Last week we had an interesting thread, at least i thought so, about how most of us are probably on the aspergers/autism spectrum. About how thatmight actually be a benefit despite being possibly mislabelled as a'dis'ability. Sure, for some people it is too extreme and may be cripplingor maybe it's still a benefit for a lucky few who maybe worked hard to"make the most of it". Many of us have tiny amounts of it and even that issometimes just enough to set us outside of mainstream society.At the end of the week i unwisely went to a pub with a friend who startedpointing out some of my "eccentricities" and physically held onto me toprevent me from leaving. Errr she's quite a hot chick so it wasn't all bad and when we go out i try to realise that almost all the glances and stares we get are because of her. Just before disappearing inside myself i looked around to reassure myself that everyone around me was different in their ways but found just a sea of white faces and all dressed in a very similarway to each other = nothing like me nor like almost any friend. I'm guessing there are a lot of people here who feel 'outside' ofmainstream society for at least 1 reason or other. Here on the list i feelsafe because no-one can judge any one else on such randomness as skin colour.Do other people here feel like they are outside of a mainstream society in a way that might show up in a photo or face-to-face? I think in a photo i might look too mainstream. A static 2 dimensional image often misses a lotof the character of a person. Would it be good to collect a bunch of photos that show us using LibreOffice? Maybe focussing mostly on the screen but enough of a hint of you or a friend that the photo gives animpression of someone interesting. On the other hand maybe it is best thatwe stick with the images we have of each other in our minds-eye? I like the idea of a montage of different users so that almost anyonelooking at the montage might recognise something of themselves in one or more of the people in the montage. If you email photos to me privately imight be able to get a local artist to put it together. I would avoid naming names unless you specifically tell me to include it.The term 'mainstream' is quite flexible and might be very different in some countries or amongst some cultures. If we look at the photos used in our marketing then simply wearing a suit would make you stand out and it mightbe good to see that sort of thing mixed in too. Regards from Tom :)Tom,I think there is a faceless anonymity that makes e-communication work. Onereason we are free to share is the safety that comes from being able to close the lid with nobody knowing who we really are. Virgil
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